I now know a smidgen more about Andrew. All I know of George is he was a deeply charitable man, ie didn't make a fuss about giving, he wrote great pop songs and sang them beautifully. Sure, he had demons, who doesn't? By the way, he put Andrew's name as co-writer on Careless Whispers, thus ensuring his mate had a royalty stream for life, even though George was the sole writer and performer. Good luck to Andrew, George's memory is a fond one. He was a funny, sassy, vulnerable star and I miss the music unwritten at his death.
I agree with all of this. I like his songs too. I also agree with the idea that we think of Ridgeley as the least successful of the two and yet he has lived the life that most of us wish for.
Rather ignores the fact he was pretty wealthy when took his fork in the road. I’m not sure how a Deliveroo driver with a family goes about being authentic. His life is a hard scrabble to better his condition. Authenticity is something you can worry about when you’re well over half way up maslow’s hierarchy of needs. Most of humanity isn’t.
I’m going to regret finding you😀 Civil debate with somebody from a different point of view is a lot of fun … but does stop you getting on with your day.
As you know I am not a fan of critical theory but it is correct in that we are largely functions of the zeitgeist we live in. So what is authenticity?
Having the strength of character to resist peer pressure to do things you don’t want to isn’t a particularly new concept. The modern usage of authenticity usually supports a disparagement of the urge for financial betterment. Maslows hierarchy is a good tool. If your idea of self esteem or self actualisation involves accumulating lots of stuff, good luck to you. It wasn’t mine or seemingly yours but I don’t disparage it.
Something in George Michael’s psyche needed fame. Something other flaw made it end badly. The two don’t need to be connected but maybe they are. Many very successful people came from humble beginnings, driven by a need to escape them. Maybe they don’t know when to stop - that is their authentic self, warts and all.
I wanted to travel when I left Uni so got a job in the Middle East. After a couple of years i wanted to move on and got a job in South Africa (1981, height of apartheid). I got loads of pressure not to go and plenty of grief on my trips home in the 10 years I was there. Ok to indulge my authentic desire to travel and resentment of being told what to think?
Somebody above praises a hard line Islamic regime for spending $100millions of aid money on military infrastructure. Violent repression of women, gays and any political opposition is ignored, as is the 7/10 atrocity and the horrendously complex history. Is that an authentic position taken after due consideration or virtue signalling a tribal identity?
I’m really interested in choice and freedom in the existentialist sense of finding your own meaning and living a life that reflects that meaning. If I ever get around to doing my PhD, that will be my topic. I think too many people are living a life that they didn't choose because they don't realise they have choices.
It’s true that folks in poverty have fewer choices than the rest of us but maybe they have more than they realise. I certainly don’t condemn someone who wants to work in Tescos for the rest of their life if that’s what they chose. But did they really choose? Or did they just accept what society gave them because they thought they had no choice?
I’m more than 50% with you but then we do stray into self help “you can be anything you want to be,” territory.
There are levels of capability (and character) required to pursue finding meaning. Sometimes you just don’t have them. Sometimes meaning varies at different times.
In my retirement I’m trying to overcome ingrained habits of procrastination to write a novel (you’re not helping 😂).
In terms of capability, I very much doubt The Booker will ever be interested but I’m fairly sure I’ll get something out in the end. It’s always been an ambition but paying the mortgage came first. I don’t regret that at all. Raising a family in a garret to satisfy some ‘suffering for my art’ aesthetic, would not have been for me.
Parts of life in the corporate salt mines were pretty dire, parts were quite fun. All contributed to my primary authentic motivations which were both competitive and a stereotypical ‘provider’ driver. Now neither need apply so another authentic driver climbs the priority list.
In a broader sense, good manners and tolerance are important to me. Values are something you can live by however you make a living. The hyperbolic righteousness of the progressive left (see our Hamas apologist above) is one of the main drivers for pushing me politically to the right.
No more today! I must get on with a character arc somewhere.
We are not so far apart on merit. I absolutely don't think that everyone can be who they want to be.
My claim is much more modest. You have more choices than you think. You can't choose to be an astronaut if you don't have the talent and the drive. But you don't have to work for Deliveroo either. You have choices.
I think the “you can be whatever you want and everyone should have a degree” mentality is actively harmful (see my post on the 11+).
I still think of myself as a lefty though. I haven't changed and I don't feel like I need to switch sides because I disagree with some people on my side. I’m still [-7,-7] on the Political Compass.
I enjoy arguing with folks on the other side. Maybe I'll learn something. Maybe they will too.
Apartheid South Africa is a tricky one. I remember being torn on this at the time. I was appalled by apartheid but the flak that the cricketers got and Paul Simon got seemed counterproductive and largely driven by unthinking conformity to a moral fashion. I would’ve gone to South Africa too. I think once society adopts a political idea — like anti-apartheid — it expects you to follow it slavishly and without question. I find it hard to do that, even if I support the ideas behind it.
It’s an interesting question: how often do celebrities who chase fame find tragedy? It might be just availability bias that we are aware of Michael Jackson and Elvis Presley because they make the news while Paul Newman and Bob Dylan just quietly go on being brilliant.
I absolutely love Alain de Botton. And this thesis is borne out in interviews of elderly people in hospice, in the last days of their lives. The number one regret they cite is not one of the many people commonly assume. The most common regret is following along with and doing what others told them they SHOULD want or be, rather than doing what they wanted to do and what felt right for them. Caving to social pressures and expectations was the most common regret -- at least among the current elderly (it's possible that by the time we are that old, social expectations won't have been so much of an issue, so perhaps that will change).
Though I gotta say: George Michael had the voice of an angel, and is my all-time favorite male vocalist, so I'm glad he chose the path he did. Everything She Wants by Wham is on my top-20 fun songs list, but it is not nearly as sublime as Freedom.
I had a girlfriend at the time who loved Wham! and I can’t even tell you how many times we saw them in concert! I’d have to pick Careless Whisper as my favourite.
I’ve been reading a lot of Sartre and friends recently. I think their notion that people who live the way they think society wants them to rather than how they would choose for themselves really captures the idea.
I haven't read that particular Botton, but I've long questioned the definition of 'success'.
I certainly don't measure it by 'salary', 'fame', or 'position' in what amounts to flawed societies, full of nepotism, and a distinct lack of equal opportunities!
I've been watching a lot of footage about Gaza.
For all the Zionist hype about 'terror tunnels' personally I applaud the ingenuity involved to create tunnels that you can drive a jeep down whilst imprisoned in a 25 mile strip under constant surveillance!
I saw a young boy create a solar system to light his families tent.
I've just watched a man who created a manual means to supply water to his neighbours, over distance and different levels, without the use of the electric pumps as there is no fuel for them.
What might these genius' have achieved were they not locked in to a 25 mile strip for 17 years? What might they have achieved had they never been colonised and denied the right to self determination on their own land?
'Success' is in the eye of the beholder!
'Success' is doing what you need to do to fulfil your needs!
'Success' comes from being honest about who you are - not basing it on what other people think you should be, or what they demand you should be, to fit their world view!
I like your last definition best — success is about being honest who you are, not what other people think you should be. That's at the centre of Sartre's idea of authenticity vs bad faith.
I have 'meritocracy' high on my list of things to think about. I don't think it's fair that some people have access to 'success' in a way that others do not. I think having the opportunity to succeed at the things you care about and are good at is important and it is not fair that this is denied to Palestinians who are trapped in a war that is not of their own making.
In a truly Just world meritocracy makes sense, but in an unjust world it's not measurable!
It brings to mind Islamic Law where theft is punished by cutting off the hand! People presume that to mean any thief, in any circumstance. In reality it is dependent on Islamic values being in place.
In a truly Islamic society, nobody would be poor, starving, homeless and thus nobody would have any need to steal. Thus any theft would have to come from a truly, very, very dark place of depriving others and taking what you have no intention of trying to earn, etc. Since we don't have any truly Islamic societies, the circumstances which would lead to a judgment for applying the punishment don't exist.
Love this piece Ragged. My son and I are big fans of School of Life too (Alain de Botton's voice is soooo soothing) and my son is going through a similar period of reflection at a George or Andrew fork in the road. Like you, I think he is going to make the Andrew choice. As I always drone on - life is a spiritual journey, not a CV. I think Trump was (and will be) a good (as a politician/leader, not someone you'd allow your daughter to travel in a lift with) President - the US killed waaay less people in other countries on his watch; but full marks to you and your wife for following your principles. All those people who said the same and didn't do it - as with Brexit - pretty shallow, eh?
Thank you, Bettina. I sometimes wonder if we did the right thing (it’s raining now) but, at that moment, it was very important to me that we come home. Dreaming of the next place now.
I now know a smidgen more about Andrew. All I know of George is he was a deeply charitable man, ie didn't make a fuss about giving, he wrote great pop songs and sang them beautifully. Sure, he had demons, who doesn't? By the way, he put Andrew's name as co-writer on Careless Whispers, thus ensuring his mate had a royalty stream for life, even though George was the sole writer and performer. Good luck to Andrew, George's memory is a fond one. He was a funny, sassy, vulnerable star and I miss the music unwritten at his death.
I agree with all of this. I like his songs too. I also agree with the idea that we think of Ridgeley as the least successful of the two and yet he has lived the life that most of us wish for.
Rather ignores the fact he was pretty wealthy when took his fork in the road. I’m not sure how a Deliveroo driver with a family goes about being authentic. His life is a hard scrabble to better his condition. Authenticity is something you can worry about when you’re well over half way up maslow’s hierarchy of needs. Most of humanity isn’t.
Totally agree Martin. My post was about living a comfortable life versus shooting for the stars.
I do think that Deliveroo drivers have more choices than they realise though.
I’m going to regret finding you😀 Civil debate with somebody from a different point of view is a lot of fun … but does stop you getting on with your day.
As you know I am not a fan of critical theory but it is correct in that we are largely functions of the zeitgeist we live in. So what is authenticity?
Having the strength of character to resist peer pressure to do things you don’t want to isn’t a particularly new concept. The modern usage of authenticity usually supports a disparagement of the urge for financial betterment. Maslows hierarchy is a good tool. If your idea of self esteem or self actualisation involves accumulating lots of stuff, good luck to you. It wasn’t mine or seemingly yours but I don’t disparage it.
Something in George Michael’s psyche needed fame. Something other flaw made it end badly. The two don’t need to be connected but maybe they are. Many very successful people came from humble beginnings, driven by a need to escape them. Maybe they don’t know when to stop - that is their authentic self, warts and all.
I wanted to travel when I left Uni so got a job in the Middle East. After a couple of years i wanted to move on and got a job in South Africa (1981, height of apartheid). I got loads of pressure not to go and plenty of grief on my trips home in the 10 years I was there. Ok to indulge my authentic desire to travel and resentment of being told what to think?
Somebody above praises a hard line Islamic regime for spending $100millions of aid money on military infrastructure. Violent repression of women, gays and any political opposition is ignored, as is the 7/10 atrocity and the horrendously complex history. Is that an authentic position taken after due consideration or virtue signalling a tribal identity?
I’m really interested in choice and freedom in the existentialist sense of finding your own meaning and living a life that reflects that meaning. If I ever get around to doing my PhD, that will be my topic. I think too many people are living a life that they didn't choose because they don't realise they have choices.
It’s true that folks in poverty have fewer choices than the rest of us but maybe they have more than they realise. I certainly don’t condemn someone who wants to work in Tescos for the rest of their life if that’s what they chose. But did they really choose? Or did they just accept what society gave them because they thought they had no choice?
I’m more than 50% with you but then we do stray into self help “you can be anything you want to be,” territory.
There are levels of capability (and character) required to pursue finding meaning. Sometimes you just don’t have them. Sometimes meaning varies at different times.
In my retirement I’m trying to overcome ingrained habits of procrastination to write a novel (you’re not helping 😂).
In terms of capability, I very much doubt The Booker will ever be interested but I’m fairly sure I’ll get something out in the end. It’s always been an ambition but paying the mortgage came first. I don’t regret that at all. Raising a family in a garret to satisfy some ‘suffering for my art’ aesthetic, would not have been for me.
Parts of life in the corporate salt mines were pretty dire, parts were quite fun. All contributed to my primary authentic motivations which were both competitive and a stereotypical ‘provider’ driver. Now neither need apply so another authentic driver climbs the priority list.
In a broader sense, good manners and tolerance are important to me. Values are something you can live by however you make a living. The hyperbolic righteousness of the progressive left (see our Hamas apologist above) is one of the main drivers for pushing me politically to the right.
No more today! I must get on with a character arc somewhere.
Good luck with your book! I would love to write a book but I have to be realistic and recognise that that will never happen.
I’d like to write though. I don't know what yet.
We are not so far apart on merit. I absolutely don't think that everyone can be who they want to be.
My claim is much more modest. You have more choices than you think. You can't choose to be an astronaut if you don't have the talent and the drive. But you don't have to work for Deliveroo either. You have choices.
I think the “you can be whatever you want and everyone should have a degree” mentality is actively harmful (see my post on the 11+).
I still think of myself as a lefty though. I haven't changed and I don't feel like I need to switch sides because I disagree with some people on my side. I’m still [-7,-7] on the Political Compass.
I enjoy arguing with folks on the other side. Maybe I'll learn something. Maybe they will too.
Apartheid South Africa is a tricky one. I remember being torn on this at the time. I was appalled by apartheid but the flak that the cricketers got and Paul Simon got seemed counterproductive and largely driven by unthinking conformity to a moral fashion. I would’ve gone to South Africa too. I think once society adopts a political idea — like anti-apartheid — it expects you to follow it slavishly and without question. I find it hard to do that, even if I support the ideas behind it.
It’s an interesting question: how often do celebrities who chase fame find tragedy? It might be just availability bias that we are aware of Michael Jackson and Elvis Presley because they make the news while Paul Newman and Bob Dylan just quietly go on being brilliant.
I absolutely love Alain de Botton. And this thesis is borne out in interviews of elderly people in hospice, in the last days of their lives. The number one regret they cite is not one of the many people commonly assume. The most common regret is following along with and doing what others told them they SHOULD want or be, rather than doing what they wanted to do and what felt right for them. Caving to social pressures and expectations was the most common regret -- at least among the current elderly (it's possible that by the time we are that old, social expectations won't have been so much of an issue, so perhaps that will change).
Though I gotta say: George Michael had the voice of an angel, and is my all-time favorite male vocalist, so I'm glad he chose the path he did. Everything She Wants by Wham is on my top-20 fun songs list, but it is not nearly as sublime as Freedom.
I had a girlfriend at the time who loved Wham! and I can’t even tell you how many times we saw them in concert! I’d have to pick Careless Whisper as my favourite.
I’ve been reading a lot of Sartre and friends recently. I think their notion that people who live the way they think society wants them to rather than how they would choose for themselves really captures the idea.
I haven't read that particular Botton, but I've long questioned the definition of 'success'.
I certainly don't measure it by 'salary', 'fame', or 'position' in what amounts to flawed societies, full of nepotism, and a distinct lack of equal opportunities!
I've been watching a lot of footage about Gaza.
For all the Zionist hype about 'terror tunnels' personally I applaud the ingenuity involved to create tunnels that you can drive a jeep down whilst imprisoned in a 25 mile strip under constant surveillance!
I saw a young boy create a solar system to light his families tent.
I've just watched a man who created a manual means to supply water to his neighbours, over distance and different levels, without the use of the electric pumps as there is no fuel for them.
What might these genius' have achieved were they not locked in to a 25 mile strip for 17 years? What might they have achieved had they never been colonised and denied the right to self determination on their own land?
'Success' is in the eye of the beholder!
'Success' is doing what you need to do to fulfil your needs!
'Success' comes from being honest about who you are - not basing it on what other people think you should be, or what they demand you should be, to fit their world view!
I like your last definition best — success is about being honest who you are, not what other people think you should be. That's at the centre of Sartre's idea of authenticity vs bad faith.
I have 'meritocracy' high on my list of things to think about. I don't think it's fair that some people have access to 'success' in a way that others do not. I think having the opportunity to succeed at the things you care about and are good at is important and it is not fair that this is denied to Palestinians who are trapped in a war that is not of their own making.
In a truly Just world meritocracy makes sense, but in an unjust world it's not measurable!
It brings to mind Islamic Law where theft is punished by cutting off the hand! People presume that to mean any thief, in any circumstance. In reality it is dependent on Islamic values being in place.
In a truly Islamic society, nobody would be poor, starving, homeless and thus nobody would have any need to steal. Thus any theft would have to come from a truly, very, very dark place of depriving others and taking what you have no intention of trying to earn, etc. Since we don't have any truly Islamic societies, the circumstances which would lead to a judgment for applying the punishment don't exist.
Love this piece Ragged. My son and I are big fans of School of Life too (Alain de Botton's voice is soooo soothing) and my son is going through a similar period of reflection at a George or Andrew fork in the road. Like you, I think he is going to make the Andrew choice. As I always drone on - life is a spiritual journey, not a CV. I think Trump was (and will be) a good (as a politician/leader, not someone you'd allow your daughter to travel in a lift with) President - the US killed waaay less people in other countries on his watch; but full marks to you and your wife for following your principles. All those people who said the same and didn't do it - as with Brexit - pretty shallow, eh?
Thank you, Bettina. I sometimes wonder if we did the right thing (it’s raining now) but, at that moment, it was very important to me that we come home. Dreaming of the next place now.